Ehrman vs. McGrew: Round 1 Review

 I was recently re-watching Tim McGrew's debate with Bart Ehrman on Unbelievable? with Justin Brierley. I wasn't planning on blogging today, but when I heard Ehrman's misleading arguments, I had to write down some replies. 

(You can listen to it here)

1: Ehrman claims the first mention of Gospel authorship is by Irenaeus c. 180. This is such a simplistic reading, & is only true of Luke. Here is a list of when, and who, mention the Gospels by name: 

Mark- Papias (100), Justin Martyr (155), Irenaeus (175), Clement of Alexandria (195), Muratorian Fragment (late second century) Matthew- Papias (100), Gospel of Thomas 13 (140-180), Apollinaris (175), Irenaeus (175), Clement of Alexandria (195), Muratorian Fragment (late second century) John- Papias (100), Ptolemy (150-175), Heracleon (150-175), Acts of John (150-200), Irenaeus (175), Hegesippus (175), Theophilus of Antioch (180), Polycrates (190), Clement of Alexandria (195), Muratorian Fragment (late second century), Act of Peter and the Twelve (200)

(I am thankful to my friend Chris for the above) 

2: Ehrman claims Justin Martyr doesn't quote John. This is questionable. He neglects to mention C.E. Hill's study on the topic, which you can read here. To my knowledge, Hill isn't some fringe scholar, he is mainstream. I wonder why Ehrman doesn't mention this? Maybe because he teaches at a seminary?

3: Ehrman goes on to say that the Gospels are quoted anonymously by all of our earliest writings. Dr. McGrew goes on to point out (rightly) that the same is done with Paul's letters. But, lets crank up McGrew's argument up a notch. Notice those same sources Ehrman goes to, do the same exact type of citation with the Old Testament! Some examples include: 

1 Clement 4:1- "For so it is written, And it came to pass after certain days that
Cain brought of the fruits of the earth a sacrifice unto God, and
Abel he also brought of the firstlings of the sheep and of their
fatness." (Italics mine)

1 Clement 4:6- "And Cain said unto Abel his brother, Let us go over unto the plain.
And it came to pass, while they Were in the plain, that Cain rose up
against Abel his brother and slew him." (Italics mine)

1 Clement 8:4-5- "and He added also a merciful judgment: Repent ye, O house of
Israel, of your iniquity; say unto the sons of My people, Though
your sins reach from the earth even unto the heaven, and though
they be redder than scarlet and blacker than sackcloth, and ye turn
unto Me with your whole heart and say Father, I will give ear unto
you as unto a holy people. And in another place He saith on this wise, Wash, be ye clean. Put away your iniquities from your souls out of My sight. Cease from your iniquities; learn to do good; seek out judgment; defend him that is wronged: give judgment for the orphan, and execute righteousness for the widow; and come and let us reason together, saith He; and though your sins be as crimson, I will make them white as snow; and though they be as scarlet, I will make them white as wool. And if ye be willing and will hearken unto Me, ye shall eat the good things of the earth; but if ye be not willing, neither hearken unto Me, a sword shall devour you; for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken these things." (Italics original)

Ehrman is simply misleading the audience here. You can look at the rest of the 1st century corpus here. 

4: Ehrman claims McGrew is appealing to authority when bringing up Martin Hengel. However, some how, Ehrman fails to realize that all McGrew is doing here is stating where he originally got the argument from. 

5: Ehrman simply resorts to weasel words when pressed on the Gospels being formally anonymous. He was very clearly using it as an argument against traditional authorship. However, I will make a few points.

a) No doubt some Greco-Roman (GR) historians/biographers identify themselves in the text, but the Gospels aren't modeled on these texts. They imitate the Old Testament history books in this regard (though not only in this way.)

b) The Old Testament history books are also formally anonymous!

c) With respect to a), lets assume the Gospel authors are trying to do the exact same thing as the elite GR historian, Xenophon does writes about himself in 3rd person, even though he is a direct eyewitness! 

Xenophon, Anabasis 3.1- “There was in the army a certain Xenophon, an Athenian, who accompanied the army neither as a general nor as a captain nor as a private soldier; but Proxenos, an old acquaintance, had sent for him.” 

Simon Gathercole, in his 2018 paper The Alleged Anonymity Of The Canonical Gospels (p. 11 fn. 37 & 38) cites 4 Roman historians, Sallust, Livy, Tacitus & Florus. According to Gathercole, none of them identify themselves in their texts. 

5: Ehrman claims that McGrew is simply assuming the Christian tradition is correct. Well, prof. McGrew, looks like all those Friday nights you spent in the library as a teenager were just a waste! Pack it up!

On a serious note, secularism isn't objectivity. If anything, he is more biased in his research, given he is on record as saying a miracle is the least probable explanation, he needs to throw out quite a number of events from antiquity!

6: Ehrman claims that the early Christians had strong theological reasons for attributing the Gospels to their respective author, but what is the theological reason for naming Mark and Luke the authors of their respective Gospels? This alone cuts against Ehrman's assertion. 

7: McGrew calls out Ehrman's bluff on his repetitious appeal to 'critical scholars'. On a side note, does Ehrman not count the likes of Bauckham, Hengel, Keener, Gathercole, et al as serious scholars? Like McGrew said "...critical scholars as in the ones that agree with you?"

8: Ehrman acts as if McGrew does not know anything about NT scholarship.

a) McGrew has access to the same books & articles Ehrman does. 

b) McGrew is associated with several erudite scholars that are in the apologetics field as well. 

9: Ehrman rambles about harmonization, yet never provides an argument against its legitimacy. 

The rest of the debate goes on to issues of alleged contradictions in the narratives, but that is old fare, and Ehrman's examples have been addressed numerous times. Two recent posts by Jonathan McLatchie come to mind, here & here.